CKC Shikoku progress
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    Fellow Canucks! Great news :) The CKC is looking to move 17 listed breeds (one being the Shikoku) toward Full Recognition in this fall’s Special Referendum.

    Polling for owners and enthusiasts will begin in July and ask for support in moving the breeds below toward full recognition and supporting their Rules of Eligibility.

    Please take the time to register now to vote at http://www.ckc.ca/en/ROE

    Fingers crossed, let's get as many votes as we can!
  • TheWalrusTheWalrus
    Posts: 1559
    I think Katja's being working on this for years
  • ShikokuSpiritShikokuSpirit
    Posts: 2226
    =(^-^)= I registered my name and address! I am supposed to receive an e-mail "shortly".
    www.airreyalis.com | Shikoku Ken image

    Shoushuu | Kotomi | Shuran | Ayla | Kukku | Maika | Asra

    Other Members of The Airreyalis Pack - Lynxiene (Belgian Malinois) | Keno & Missy (Alaskan Klee Kai)
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    I checked the link out but I don't see Shikoku listed there... was it earlier?
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    Oh no, @Kaja I guess they took it down :( I wonder why!
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    That's a good question. Does anyone know the answer? :O
  • aykayk
    Posts: 1979
    The entire www.ckc.ca website won't load for me.
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    The site is back up again, but Shikoku Ken isn't listed anywhere there! What happened?

    I sent CKC and ROE an email asking about it, in case there was some confusion on our part. But perhaps someone else will know.
    Post edited by Kaja at 2016-07-24 20:01:15
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    @kaja sent them an email too! Their only response was that they had the site up for 30 days to gather a list of interested people. I think that deadline just ended! Unfortunately.
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    @grayjj Mhm they said the same to me too, so I guess we will find out once the emails are sent out if Shikoku are involved still (they said in the next few days?).
  • I got an e-mail and just put in my vote for Shikoku gaining full CKC Recognition.

    When I get back home I will see if I can post the link to their survey here.

    www.airreyalis.com | Shikoku Ken image

    Shoushuu | Kotomi | Shuran | Ayla | Kukku | Maika | Asra

    Other Members of The Airreyalis Pack - Lynxiene (Belgian Malinois) | Keno & Missy (Alaskan Klee Kai)
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    Just an update, I received a formal CKC ballot via snail mail -- so if you managed to register, you'll likely receive a letter.

    I hope that however many of us vote "yes" will make it happen :)
  • You can just vote and get full recognition? AkC has all kinds of requirements- a through written standard, a functioning club, a certain number of dogs have to have titles, the club has to hold a certain # of shows, there has to be a certain # of dogs registered, and then you have to go through FSS _> Miscellaneous before full recognition. In CKC, there's just a ballot? Does it have other breeds on it - as in "Which of these breeds should be fully admitted?" or it just Shikoku yea or nay?

    Dog registries are very peculiar beasts...
    Post edited by WrylyBrindle at 2016-08-05 07:28:29
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    @wrylybrindle no this is certainly not, "just a vote". Katja has been working for years to get a Shikoku accepted. Currently it's a listed breed, this voting period is to evaluate a short list of breeds who may be considered to move into an official accepted breed. I'm sure this is only one tiny step in about 100 others, but any bit of progress that can be made is a good thing!
  • no this is certainly not, "just a vote". Katja has been working for years to get a Shikoku accepted.


    Let's have some details, then- Unlike Facebook and Twitter, this is a Forum which is only good when people share lots of details and experiences and write things out.

    I laid out examples of some of the hoops the AKC makes breeds jump through to get to full recognition, to set you up (or anyone, really!) to share what's the same/different. Spitting back that it's "certainly not, 'just a vote'" doesn't educate or explain anything, or add to our collective NKF knowledge. If you know, share! It would be really cool to know what other experiences are.

    I don't forsee my breed (Kai) getting out of FSS anytime soon, since the club doesn't do the things the AKC wants to see (described above). I know of exactly two people showing Shikoku in AKC, and already one has a CM title, however, so likely Shikoku will move up to MISC before Kai do. Kai need to get a LOT more organized and participate if anyone in the breed really does want full recognition- we/they may not want it that badly. AKC requires (among many other things) something like 300 individual dogs registered before breeds move ups level and then another few hundred on top of THAT to move up to Full- are there even 300 Shikoku in Canada, or is the requirement different? Meat and potatoes- tell us!
  • Online Ballot:

    https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/MXYQG8Z
    www.airreyalis.com | Shikoku Ken image

    Shoushuu | Kotomi | Shuran | Ayla | Kukku | Maika | Asra

    Other Members of The Airreyalis Pack - Lynxiene (Belgian Malinois) | Keno & Missy (Alaskan Klee Kai)
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    It does not seem as strict over here, mainly with no breed minimum - but it's more just a active participation + waiting game + politics...
    (edited to add:) I don't know much more than outlined below which I could find as public ckc info, because most of this is driven by Katja :) I'm sure there's many more details to this process I'm not aware of.

    To clarify: The Shikoku is already a "listed" breed with CKC, which equivalent is a Miscellaneous breed for AKC.

    To get to that Mischellaneous Breed stage:
    - No minimum number of dogs
    - Written requests including registrations, pedigraees, breed standard, etc in formal application
    - Recognition in a foreign club or AKC required
    - Establishment of a breed club may be advised
    - Active breed participation
    - Decision made by board of directors/polling result to determine eligibility

    Now we are in Phase 2, hoping to gain recognition of the breed already "listed" on the miscellaneous list
    - Minimum 3 years as a "listed" breed
    - Active breed participation
    - Formal request by breeder of the breed including registrations, foreign dog application, template to establish the dog breed traits and breed standards [size, color, coat, body, shape,characteristics, variability]
    - Polling phase (where we're at) to determine if majority of breeders are in favor of recognizing breed
    - Application to be made to Agriculture Canada by CKC to add and approve breed
    - If approved, then changes to be amended
    Post edited by GrayJJ at 2016-08-07 22:40:47
  • Thanks, that's pretty interesting. Im curious what UKC requires now and will have to go research that. (Kai are already legit in UKC, and maybe all the NK are, so it's moot but interesting to compare) I think my take-home message here is that dog registries are really just their own special clubs and some require more hoop-jumping than maybe is really necessary. I have been following a fb group of AKC- FSS breed owners and they are forever railing about being "second class citizens" and against all the obstacles to recognition, while others take a stance akin to "quit bitchin' - when i was in Breed X we had to do it too. It's only fair that your breed has to do all these steps like We did" and then complaining about how "some clubs" aren't holding the required number of shows so theres not enough venues to get points (active participation) and finish dogs (another hoop to complete). It sounds like AKC is trying to make it very difficult and I wonder if all registries compared that they aren't being a bit TOO obstructionist about it compared to other registries.
  • here is what UKC requires. Seems like a lot of description and intention and makes AKC look like a pain in the butt.

    http://www.ukcdogs.com/Web.nsf/WebPages/Registration/BreedRecognitionRequirements

    UKC already recognizes all the NK, so this is only relevant as a comparison.
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    I voted. Family and friends also voted.

    My concern is how are they tracking the votes? Is there something preventing a popular tumblr user, for instance, from sharing the link and asking people interested in the breed to vote? I'm legitimately curious because I don't want all our votes to become void if they get a large amount of people submitting, haha.

    Edit: just heard back from Katja and she doesn't want it to go on to social media either. Just in case of the above happening, I'm guessing. So while I'd love to get more votes for this, I will pass this around to only friends and family who love Kaja and support the breed ~ I really hope it goes through!
    Post edited by Kaja at 2016-08-10 16:09:31
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    @Kaja agreed re: sharing, but let's hope this goes through too :)

    @wrylybrindle interesting info! I guess AKC is the most stringent on requirements.
    It's tricky here for CKC to earn points because you need the same breed dog to complete against to win against OR happen to win the entire group class. There haven't been enough Shikoku's here to be showing here but it seems like it's slowly growing now tbd :) I think if there were more active showings across the country (not just concentrated in the West coast), it would help recognition/breed listing to proceed earlier...
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    Aside from the e-vote, there's also the traditional ballot system. If anyone here got a ballot in the mail don't forget to send it out before the deadline this month! Really rooting for this to go through.
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    Does anyone know what happened with this? xD
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    It went through :) Shikoku is an official breed!
  • koujichankoujichan
    Posts: 19
    It went through :) Shikoku is an official breed!


    That's awesome! Do you know when exactly it went through?

    Here's the standard, if anyone's interested: http://www.ckc.ca/en/Choosing-a-Dog/Choosing-a-Breed/Hounds/Shikoku
  • CrispyCrispy
    Posts: 1806
    I wonder why black and tan was cut out...
    Akiyama no Roushya || 秋山の狼室 || www.kishu-ken.org
  • emi802emi802
    Posts: 290
    "really really really dark sesame" (just kidding)
  • WrylyBrindleWrylyBrindle
    Posts: 3209
    Shikoku are under Hounds in CKC?
  • CrispyCrispy
    Posts: 1806
    I wish the Japanese dogs were hounds in AKC. :( I saw that and was kind of jealous. I think "working" is kind of a lazy "catch all" designation.
    Akiyama no Roushya || 秋山の狼室 || www.kishu-ken.org
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    The Shikoku has been on the site for a while now as a 'Listed' breed, how do we tell if it's been accepted to Full Recognition? The breed standard still has it mentioned as a 'Listed' type.

    I learned that the CKC chip program doesn't offer full service in regards to their microchip tracking unless the dog is fully recognized, and not a listed breed. I had to manually sign her up for stuff for that to happen. -_-
    Post edited by Kaja at 2017-07-25 18:05:32
  • GrayJJGrayJJ
    Posts: 267
    The referendum went through just before Christmas.

    I'm not sure about the B&T being left out :(

    The breed has always listed under hounds, likely bcuz they would fit the hunting description:
    'Hound breeds are split into two factions – those long-limbed canines that hunt by sight (aptly enough referred to as sighthounds or, occasionally, gazehounds) and those that hunt by scent, not surprisingly called scent hounds. Their quarry is the furred and four-footed variety.'
  • KajaKaja
    Posts: 200
    Anyone able to clarify this? Or are they just too lazy to replace the 2007 document that still has them as LISTED BREED-GROUP II HOUNDS? xD

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