Any litters for 2016?
  • He may have, I have no idea nor would I bother to speculate without further information. I'm just giving context for what people mean by good breeder because I noticed it hadn't been outlined in the thread and I thought it would be useful for future readers.
  • Okay.
  • Thank you for not speculating, like everyone else did.
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 3449
    Health testing as mentioned above is usually one of the things that I recommend people to inquire about in the first discussions with a potential breeder. If that info isn't available or a solid reason for why it isn't completed, then it really doesn't matter to me how nice the person is or how much they say they love their dogs as pets first...

    CEA, Collie Eye Anomaly is the additional disease we are testing the Hokkaido for.
    Hokusei Kashinoki Hokkaido and Shiba Inu
    masakadoshiba@hotmail.com
    www.masakadoshiba@wordpress.com
    www.hokkaidousa.wordpress.com
    Post edited by lindsayt at 2016-02-24 23:56:25
  • CrimsonO2CrimsonO2
    Posts: 2215
    ...Y'all don't even know his name.


    You're right, we don't know his name. Are you willing to share it with us so we can form our own opinions about his breeding program (and won't waste time on this thread further)? That way you won't feel the need to constantly defend him and we won't muddy up this discussion further. As @violet_in_seville said. Many of us here are part of the NK community because we believe in and are just as passionate about preservation as we are about furthering knowledge about the NK breeds.

    Jesse Pelayo

  • He's not a very active breeder, as I've mentioned, he's a hobby breeder. If any of you are from the east coast you'll recognize the name "Herb Chambers". Well, he works side by side with him and also owns his own business restoring cars and doing custom trim work. He's a busy dude. I also don't have his permission to just share his number on the Internet and I don't think he'd appreciate it. Can I upload pictures from my phone here? I have pictures of his dogs and some of Buddha's litter mates. That's all I can really offer you.
  • CrimsonO2CrimsonO2
    Posts: 2215
    @LaurenSabino182,

    Sharing information is the first step to understanding. We definitely don't need his contact number and wouldn't ask of it. Knowing of your breeder's dogs will definitely help us better understand your position.

    This forum doesn't allow direct uploads of pictures unfortunately. You can upload to other sites like flickr or picasa and link them to this forum using the image icon above the area to write posts.


    Jesse Pelayo

  • @LaurenSabino182 I didn't say that your breeder isn't responsible. I provided you with some lists so that YOU could check all the items on the list. You know the breeder, we don't. You now have the tools you need, use it. Check into it. Find out for yourself. Get independent confirmation (ie. look records up on OFA rather than take his word that "they're healthy"). Be secure in your knowledge.
    「怪獣荘秋田犬」Kaiju Kennels Japanese Akita and Hokkaido, Claire Matthews
    http://www.facebook.com/PoetikDragon
    http://www.facebook.com/KaijuKennels
    http://www.kaijukennels.com
    Post edited by PoetikDragon at 2016-02-25 01:46:31
  • HeidiHeidi
    Posts: 3386
    I just want to say how much I appreciate everyone sharing information without getting angry. I know topics like these sometimes become heated and I'm so glad to see this level of composure.
    Dogs: Rakka (shikoku), Sosuke (kai), Effie (bc/kelpie)
    Cats: Hester, Batgirl, Stephanie, Harley
  • How about if you want to see photos of his dogs so badly, just email me. Sabinolauren@gmail.com. Seems silly though. They look like every other Shiba or Shiba puppy you'd ever see.
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3977
    Has your breeder ever shown his Shibas at AKC dog shows? Does he have a kennel name (which is also often required to be on thw registered name of the dog)?

    The only responsible breeders I know of in your area are women, but I could be wrong.


    Regardless, even if you don't like it and appreciate it, everyone who posted here cares. We all care about making informed decisions when adding a new dog, and we care enough to spend our time here hoping you won't make a decision that you and your pup will hate down the road. Though it may feel like you have closed your mind to some great info and getting defensive, deep down I think you're still listening to what is being said. Whatever you choose, in the end it's your decision and you'll have to live with the consequences.

    Personally, I think your best option is to stay local and either adopt from a rescue or buy from a responsible breeder.
    image
  • K. Again, I've had people messaging me apologizing for certain commenters and people saying they've had similar, judgmental experiences here. I think I've had every right to be "defensive" and others don't disagree. I didn't really get much out of this but regret for asking a question and black lash for everything I said thereafter. Literally everything. But whatever. This whole thing was a waste of time.
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 3449
    We are a "show me" group of people and love to see pictures and pedigrees and OFAs, otherwise it's hard to take a persons word. Concrete evidence is always appreciated in conversation (in real life too, you will come to understand I hope).
    Hokusei Kashinoki Hokkaido and Shiba Inu
    masakadoshiba@hotmail.com
    www.masakadoshiba@wordpress.com
    www.hokkaidousa.wordpress.com
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 3449
    Maybe those people can help you find what you are looking for, then.
    Hokusei Kashinoki Hokkaido and Shiba Inu
    masakadoshiba@hotmail.com
    www.masakadoshiba@wordpress.com
    www.hokkaidousa.wordpress.com
    Post edited by lindsayt at 2016-02-25 06:34:49
  • Well, I'm not Ron (the breeder), so I can't just give his information out. I told you, he's a HOBBY breeder about 20 times now. He doesn't show, he doesn't run a kennel, etc. He's just a guy that loves the breed and has puppies every once in a while. Healthy, perfectly nice puppies. Some are therapy dogs, ones a "spokesdog" for a car dealership where he meets a ton of people and kids all the time. They're all great dogs. Most just go to family, friends, and people around the area that he knows. His dogs aren't breaking records or getting show titles, but they're wonderful dogs. Sorry if that's irresponsible for you.
  • Who, what?
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 3449
    It's irresponsible not to health test. That was the point made earlier (several times). Also nobody wants or is asking for the guys number or contact info, ok?
    Hokusei Kashinoki Hokkaido and Shiba Inu
    masakadoshiba@hotmail.com
    www.masakadoshiba@wordpress.com
    www.hokkaidousa.wordpress.com
  • And I never said he didn't health test. Did I say that? Did I say anything to make it seem like he didn't do that or didn't care about his dogs or this breed? No, I did not. Yes, he health tests.
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 3449
    No you didn't say he doesn't health test but seemed to be intentionally omitting that specific information, and still are, so...
    Hokusei Kashinoki Hokkaido and Shiba Inu
    masakadoshiba@hotmail.com
    www.masakadoshiba@wordpress.com
    www.hokkaidousa.wordpress.com
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3977
    Well technically, most anyone who shows dogs, or breeds them for improvement and preservation, are hobby breeders. For these people, dog breeding isn't a business as they aren't making any money from the hard work they do.

    For the most part, in the US at least, pretty much all responsible Shiba breeders show their dogs. Some do participate in dog sports, but for the most part the Shiba Inu is a show breed and not a working one. If Buddha's breeder doesn't show or health test or have a puppy contract or do any of the things listed in an earlier comment, then he does not meet what the general dog community defines as responsible.

    It doesn't necessarily means there's anything wrong with him, his dogs, or Buddha; there are many byb breeders with good intentions. It just means that he isn't really helping the breed overall (which should be the focus in any dog breeder).
    image
    Post edited by Calia at 2016-02-25 06:48:15
  • There was a contract, and he does health test. Sorry he has a career outside of his dogs and doesn't show. I've had show quality dogs before and never showed them. Not because I'm a horrible person, because I never cared to. Stop calling him a byb. And what information am I withholding?! God you people are crazy.
  • Can this thread stop, please. I'm done defending myself to deaf ears. Please stop posting here. It's getting quite annoying. If you actually want to talk to me and not patronize me, PM me.
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3977
    Don't think there's any responsible show breeder who doesn't have a career outside of their dogs, since for the most part showing and dogs sports is a hobby. A responsible breeder will do these things not to put money in their pocket, but to determine if that particular dog is worth breeding and to find complementary dogs to breed to.

    image
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 3449
    OFA links are always appreciated as are results of specific health tests recommended for the breed when discussing a breeder as someone to recommend to buy from in North America.
    Hokusei Kashinoki Hokkaido and Shiba Inu
    masakadoshiba@hotmail.com
    www.masakadoshiba@wordpress.com
    www.hokkaidousa.wordpress.com
  • Caila, as I've mentioned a few times, he's not in it to make a profit. Someone offered $3500 for my dog but he turned him down and I only paid $1000. He didn't like that man and thought I'd be much better. As I've also mentioned, he's quite successful. He literally has a home theatre, gym, and a helicopter pad in his backyard. Sounds crazy, but we got a tour of his home. So you can believe he's not too worried about a profit on a few puppies. And I don't have any links to show you. I'm just an owner here.
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3977
    If he wasn't interested in making money then he wouldn't charge anything or less for the puppies he produces. I've known some responsible breeders who gave the puppy away for free because they really loved the home that the puppy would be going to.

    So far, you really haven't shown any proof that he isn't a byb.
    image
  • Alright, I don't give a shit anymore. Leave. Me. Alone.
  • sunyatasunyata
    Posts: 4545
    I wanted to point out something that no one else has mentioned with regards to responsible and reputable breeders:

    Responsible breeders care about where their dogs' genes end up. Their purchase contracts for non-show, non-breeding dogs almost always require spay/neuter. Unless there are special circumstances, if a breeder sells a dog without a spay/neuter contract, especially for a dog that does not meet the breed standard, he or she is NOT a responsible breeder.

    To the OP: Instead of arguing with everyone, why not provide some sort of proof to back up your claims. As a bystander to the majority of this conversation, you have gotten incredibly defensive when other members have been trying to help you and ensure that you make an informed decision with regards to adding another dog to your family.

    If you claim that your breeder is responsible, health tests, breeds to improve the breed, etc., then provide some additional information. Bragging that he is rich and has a heli-pad does nothing to improve your credibility. OFA/CERF links will. Providing your pup's pedigree will (all breeders are required to have a kennel name registered with AKC in order for the puppies to be registered).

    No one wants you, your Shiba, or your potential new dog to be unhappy or unsafe. We want to see you get the pet that will work best for your situation. But in order for you to achieve getting that pet, you have to stop being so defensive. You need to open your mind up a little, realize that you are incredibly young and have relatively minimal experience with dogs. We were all 20 once. We all thought we knew everything and could conquer the world. We were ALL wrong and unfortunately made mistakes because of it.

    Part of growing up and becoming an adult is understanding that there are people out there with more experience and more knowledge than you. It is up to you to listen to advice and opinions from those with more experience and use that information to make the most informed decision you can. Obviously it is your life and only you can live it. But you can choose to live it informed and educated instead of on impulse and with ignorance. (This goes for everything in life, not just purchasing a dog.)
    Bella 2Mountains 2Nola 2
    Casey, with Bella and Nola, hanging out in the mountains of Virginia.
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