Ca SB1221- bill to ban the use of hunting dogs to hunt bear and bobcat. (oppose)
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Another attempt to ban hunters from using working breeds.


    Legislature Takes Aim at Banning Dogs for Hunting Bears and Bobcats
     
    The Humane Society of the United States (HSUS) has joined forces with Senator Ted Lieu and Senate President Pro Tempore Darrell Steinberg to introduce Senate Bill 1221, legislation that would outlaw the use of dogs for hunting bears and bobcats in California.  This misguided legislation not only threatens the long-standing tradition of hunting these species with hounds, but would set precedent placing all other types of hunting with dogs in serious jeopardy.  In addition to this concern, COHA is committed to ensuring that all natural resource management decisions - including method of take - are appropriately made by the California Fish and Commission, in public forum and based on the best available science.
     
    COHA will work with our member organizations - including the California Houndsmen for Conservation and the U.S. Sportsmen's Alliance - and our individual members to defeat this blatant anti-hunting measure. Stay tuned to future Field Wires for more information and how you can assist COHA in this effort.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
    Post edited by shishiinu at 2012-06-26 18:20:06
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Here's the link as described by Senator Lieu. For those who support the use of dogs for hunting, please let them know that this is not right.

    http://sd28.senate.ca.gov/news/2012-03-22-sented-w-lieu-introduces-bill-end-unsporting-and-inhumane-practice-using-packs-dogs-

    Every thing described is untrue and exaggerated. If this passes the next up will be bird dogs, boar dogs, herding dogs, and breed bans. All coming to a state near you.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 3012
    This really sad. :(

    Sorry this is happening sad I thought this was land of the free, but it seems government is getting more and more controlled on things.

    BSL, no dogs for hunting soon no dogs as pets..
    Photobucket
    Nicole, 7year old Bella(Boxer), and 7year old Saya(Shiba inu)
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Exactly, this is how it starts.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    This is crazy! :(
  • InuRyuuInuRyuu
    Posts: 47
    Just remember, "We are from the government and are here to take care of you. After all we know better than you". Little by little they chip away at our freedoms and right to self determination. One day the average person will wake up and ask how could this happen?
  • LosechLosech
    Posts: 2081
    Ugh, this is stupid. If you find a petition against it, let me know.
    image
    Post edited by Losech at 2012-03-24 11:08:28
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    I will and InuRyuu is right one. This is just the start and what's scary is that this actually might pass.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • aykayk
    Posts: 1979
    From a NAIA alert:


    PLEASE OPPOSE SB 1221 bans hunting with hounds

    Take Action!
    Please maintain traditional hunting practices!


    Please oppose California Senate Bill 1221, a bill to ban bear and bobcat hunting with hounds

    Successful wildlife management programs rely on the application of well developed biological principles to sustain and perpetuate healthy populations of wildlife and conserve the natural environment. State-based wildlife management programs, which monitor animal populations and utilize regulated hunting to achieve their mandates, are so successful they have become the model for the rest of the world. The partnership between hunters and government agencies saves taxpayers money while enabling private citizens to help the state curb unsustainable populations and conserve habitat.

    When hunting is banned, the state loses licensing revenue and state agencies must hire the same sportsmen at taxpayer expense who formerly paid a licensing fee to hunt, to cull out-of-control populations. At a time when state budgets are going broke, it’s grossly irresponsible to ban hunting without a sound scientific basis.

    The ban on bear and bobcat hunting with hounds that Senate Bill 1221 seeks is not based on sound wildlife management principles, nor have any scientifically valid reasons been offered as the basis of the bill. Black bear populations have doubled since the early 1980, while the habitat available to sustain them has decreased. The number of bobcats taken by hunters in the state has steadily declined from 3700 in 1980 to only 238 in 2010. No scandalous "black sheep" events have marred the image of hunting in recent times. So what is driving SB 1221?

    SB 1221 was introduced by Senators Ted Lieu and Darrell Steinberg, and sponsored by the most aggressive anti-hunting activist group in the nation, the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS). SB 1221 offers HSUS a two-fer: a high profile opportunity to push their radical anti-hunting agenda while sticking their finger in the eye of the California Fish and Game Commission for not caving in to their demands.

    NAIA Trust urges lawmakers to follow the process established by California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) to assure that policies impacting the state's natural resources are based upon the best available science. We also urge lawmakers to oppose changes in traditional hunting practices that are based on dogma rather than an understanding of wildlife conservation.

    There are no sound scientific, practical or economic reasons to support SB 1221.

    NAIA Trust joins the California Outdoor Heritage Alliance, the California Houndsmen for Conservation, the Masters of Foxhounds, the US Sportsmen's Alliance and the California Responsible Pet Owners Coalition in opposing SB 1221 and calls on other California dog enthusiasts to urge their representatives to reject it as well.

    Write your representative now by scrolling to the Take Action link at the top. This will bring you to a list of talking points which you can select by simply clicking on them. After selecting the ones you agree with most, please change them to your own words so that each letter will be unique.

    Post edited by ayk at 2012-04-07 21:23:50
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Thanks for posting!
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • AraksAraks
    Posts: 802
    Sent! Thanks for the link
  • HeidiHeidi
    Posts: 3379
    That link isn't going to work for me, because I'm not from California, but I will figure out a way to send a letter. Rules about hunting and working dogs made up by people who don't understand hunting or working with dogs are complete non-sense!
    Rakka 落下(Shikoku Ken), Sosuke 宗介 (Kai Ken), Hester, Stephanie, and Batgirl(cats)
    image
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    Thanks for posting!
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Well guys unfortunately SB1221 passed te senate Comittee for natural resources approved the bill 5-3. I believe this will now goto the house for approval to be on the ballot box in November. Even with 600 opponents and mass e-mails, phone calls, and speech time, the politicians ignored the opposition to SB1221.

    Sad day for the hounds men and women of California and the nation. HSUS comming to a state near you.

    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • tjbart17tjbart17
    Posts: 4055
    crap
  • sjp051993sjp051993
    Posts: 1605
    Dislike
    Stacey living with Tora, Kazue, Ritsu and Kuma the Shiba
    www.suteishiikennels.com

    DSCF0686IMG_0940 - Version 2DSCF0714IMG_1151

    10443860_10202258803333634_2133731540_n
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    boo
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 3012
    :(
    Photobucket
    Nicole, 7year old Bella(Boxer), and 7year old Saya(Shiba inu)
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Counting down the days until hunting boars with dogs become illegal...
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • I'm really sorry to hear this. I was disturbed, too, but how the description of the bill posted in the beginning of the thread makes it sound as if this really is something people who care about animals and dogs WOULD want to oppose--it really distorts what hunting with dogs is about, and makes it sound like people who hunt with dogs area also routinely cruel to their dogs. Of course the majority of people who care about animals would read that and say "oh yeah, this is a terrible thing" instead of knowing what hunting with dogs is really like. This kind of misinformation is really awful.
    Lisa, Toby (Shiba), Oskar and Zora (American Akita), and Leo (Kai Ken)
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Exactly, it's just a bunch of lies and distorted opinions. The fact is that ca hounds men and women are a vital part of conserving black bears and bobcats. Not only does this allow hunters to accurately choose mature animals, it also teaches the animals released that humans are scary. We'll see what happens after this, it's going to take some money to fight this now but there's still a chance that it may not pass.

    Keep fingers crossed.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • yiasthojyiasthoj
    Posts: 116
    I really hope the bill doesn't pass. It would suck if we can't use our dogs to hunt anymore. Is the DNR opposing this bill as well?
  • aykayk
    Posts: 1979
    The bill is up in the full Senate for a vote. Here's a link on how to write to your Senators:

    http://capwiz.com/naiatrust/issues/alert/?alertid=61280081&queueid=8268433756
  • I will just never understand why people think hunting with dogs is cruel. It's really normal where I'm from and honestly I think it's a blast for the dogs. I'm not really interested myself, but I honestly still thought about taking it up because I think my dog could be really good at it with the right training and I think he'd enjoy it too.
  • HeidiHeidi
    Posts: 3379
    I think people are opposed to a pack of dozens of hounds chasing down and ripping to shreds a defenceless wild animal, which admittedly is less humane than a simple bullet. Of course, people don't realize that that's not really what's going on.

    From what I've read, hunting with dogs became illegal here in Alberta after someone let their pack of dogs rip apart a coyote close to the city. There was an uproar and they just took the whole thing too far. I think it's mainly the fact that hunting is becoming less popular, and all these laws are being pushed by urbanites who don't really know what they're talking about and are taking a black-and-white approach to something they don't understand. It's a real shame. It's not even legal to blood trail wounded game with a dog now because of this overreaction.

    And then of course they frame these laws like you'd be a monster not to support them. It's like if I went up to someone and said, "Either you're a child molester, or you'll give me $50!"
    Rakka 落下(Shikoku Ken), Sosuke 宗介 (Kai Ken), Hester, Stephanie, and Batgirl(cats)
    image
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3975
    @hondru, your comment reminded me of this newspaper clipping:
    image


    It's sad because so many people actually think like that, or feel that since you can get meat commercially then there's no use to hunting. These are the same people who don't realize how poorly treated the livestock are and how many bad things are in commercial meats.
    image
  • wow ^^ i think hunting is better for the animal than feedlots... i mean at least they get to roam and eat then one day it ends abruptly. Feed lots are terrible conditions, the animals are overfed and have health issues. Best case scenario is raised on a nice big farm, but its not practical to feed a lot of people.
  • LosechLosech
    Posts: 2081
    @lizzysilvertongue Properly done sustainable farming with crop and animal rotation is a very good system for producing a lot of food in a small amount of space. Some farmers do it and provide more and healthier food than your standard feedlot without the terrible environmental harm and animal abuse. Most that follow that style are pretty small though, but if more people (consumers) paid attention there would be more demand, and more farmers who'd do it, and the need for food would be met. There would be less of a "need" for inhumane treatment of animals intended to be eaten if people actually gave a crap. Same goes for crops. The current system destroys the soil and pollutes water, kills beneficial insects, encourages disease, etc.

    Anywho, yeah, hunted meat is much better than feedlot meat in both life and taste. Most people don't see that because you, the hunter, goes out and shoots the animal instead of going to the store and buying it already killed and cut up for you. And it tastes better because it ate a proper diet during it's entire life.
    Why should they care what other people do for food? It really doesn't affect them at all. It's not fair for someone who doesn't participate to be able to make the rules. But hey, that's how this wonderful country works.

    Once banning hounds in in effect, what's to stop them from coming after the bird dogs? And hunting in general? I really don't understand a lot of people.
    image
  • CarabooACarabooA
    Posts: 551
    Sorry, just came out of a stunned state after reading the news clipping.... hunting is so prevalent where we live I forget sometimes how people think (or rather don't think) about where their food comes from....
    What day is it?
    Why, it's Today....
    Ah, my favorite day!

    PrettyKi11-13-12 OutsidePlease11-13-12-1Mirraheartssnow
    Kitora (Kai Ken), Kunai (Kai Ken) and Mirra (Siberian Husky/Border Collie)
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3975
    @CarabooA - Yeah, it's amazing how people lack the basic understanding of where meat comes from. I've met a few people who actually believed that meat was something the animals would drop, kind of like how chickens lay eggs. And there was another person who believed that all meat was manufactured, like how candy and soy foods are manufactured. When they found out that the animals had to actually be killed and butchered, these people looked to be about to lose their lunch.
    image
  • CarabooACarabooA
    Posts: 551
    @Calia - again I say "Gasp" !!! I really think I would be lost for words if I came across that...lol
    What day is it?
    Why, it's Today....
    Ah, my favorite day!

    PrettyKi11-13-12 OutsidePlease11-13-12-1Mirraheartssnow
    Kitora (Kai Ken), Kunai (Kai Ken) and Mirra (Siberian Husky/Border Collie)
  • Reading about where people think meat comes from makes me want to start bashing my head into a wall. I can understand not knowing exactly how the animals are farmed---it's not exactly like people really put that out there for people to farm---but not knowing it's dead animal is kind of lacking a basic understanding of the human language and what it means for something to be meat.
  • CarabooACarabooA
    Posts: 551
    lolol, so I've had this thing playing in my head all day and it goes something like this:
    So, you just walk up to the cow and ask it to open it's hide and give you it's rump for a roast you'd like to cook, right?
    Sure! Try it... the meat the black cow grows tastes best!
    Excuse me mister cow... I'd like a 3lb roast for tonight, please?
    Mooooooo
    Cow opens up and hooves out the meat it grew just for them......
    Hmmmm... I think it plays much funnier in my head... lol
    What day is it?
    Why, it's Today....
    Ah, my favorite day!

    PrettyKi11-13-12 OutsidePlease11-13-12-1Mirraheartssnow
    Kitora (Kai Ken), Kunai (Kai Ken) and Mirra (Siberian Husky/Border Collie)
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 3012
    "poorly treated the livestock are and how many bad things are in commercial meats."

    That's why I go to farmer market and get Saya's organs and sometimes meat from local places.. I went to a local farm who raises pig's, chicken, turkey, and now duck. The smell isn't bad I didn't smell anything.

    If you drive by usual closed in pig farm you'll notice how disgusting the smell is.

    You see pig tails sold at grocery and the tail is cropped, not curly they do that because the pig's are in such close quarters.

    I seen some gruesome videos of fox pens where there is 6 dogs tearing up a coyote while it's still alive barely able to defend itself.

    Things like that ruin people's perception on hunting with dogs to me what I've learned on dogs hunting, but it's not much is most dogs are used to retrieve, bay, and catch, flush rabbits, pheasant, and chase deer for the hunter. I could be wrong, but my perception is the hunter should make the kill and or final blow not the dog. If your hunting for pelt or food a torn up animal won't make a good pelt or food item..

    Sad so many bad hunters ruin it for good ones like you guys. :\

    I gotten some yummy free deer from local hunter they thought it was freezer burnt so gave to me. looked fine when I thawed it out. Ah well.
    Photobucket
    Nicole, 7year old Bella(Boxer), and 7year old Saya(Shiba inu)
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3975
    @CarabooA - LoL. "Order our specialty cows today, equipped with meat growing compartment. Pay a little extra and the cow will come with an upgraded compartment that preseasons and tenderizes the meat, no more worrying about preparing the meat, just toss in the oven and the food comes out tasting great every time."

    I'm glad that my mom raised me with at least some sense of how the world works, it also helped living next to a lake that we would fish in every summer (though we never ate the fish because of the pollutants in the water). Some of my relatives and people I know can't even handle cutting up an uncooked whole chicken, and here I am practically ripping it apart with my bare hands and a knife. Grew up prepping whole squid for frying up, drooling the whole time because I loves my fried calamari.


    But seriously, the more restrictions made the more doors are opened for other restrictions and eventual elimination. Ban the use of dogs now can lead to banning hunting altogether, and if there are no hunters then who are we going to rely on to get us meat and furs should there be an apocalypse.
    image
  • CarabooACarabooA
    Posts: 551
    @Calia - I WANT THAT COW!!!! lolol
    What day is it?
    Why, it's Today....
    Ah, my favorite day!

    PrettyKi11-13-12 OutsidePlease11-13-12-1Mirraheartssnow
    Kitora (Kai Ken), Kunai (Kai Ken) and Mirra (Siberian Husky/Border Collie)
  • AraksAraks
    Posts: 802
    I thought this would be the perfect place to put this. Oh, and this scares the crap out of me.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/11/us-science-meat-f-idUSTRE7AA30020111111

    It's literally something I had been dreading since I read the book "Feed" by M.T. Anderson. If I recall, there is something like a filet mingon farm there where blood is pumped into the meat. It's a very interesting book, and I'd recommend it. It made me not want to used electronics for a while, and kinda scares you about the advancement of the world and what not.
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 3012
    Yucky.. Food inc. and the doc Fresh was good enough for me to know the meat industry is disgusting..

    I get all Saya's organs grass fed and free ranged some meat too. I figure since organs has the vitamins and minerals it's important to have good kind and fresh.. hehe coarse not everyone has sources for it with local farms and stuff..
    Photobucket
    Nicole, 7year old Bella(Boxer), and 7year old Saya(Shiba inu)
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Sorry I been lagging on the forum, with Riki's passing I been anti social. So SB1221 has moved up to the assembly floor to the parks, water, and wildlife committee.

    I urge those of you who truly believe that hunting with dogs is part of sound conservation and good wildlife mangent to call assembly member Mike Gatto at 916-319-2043 to have him oppose SB1221.

    The anti hunting and anti animal group have stepped up and have gained quite a bit of momentum. They have based their agenda on emotions and lies and 1221 will hurt california's bear population tremendously. It amazes me that a groups emotional propaganda is louder then sound scientific research even with a overwhelming opposition to SB1221.

    As I have said before this is just the start and as most know HSUS will affect everyone including non hunting dog owners.

    Please call assembly man Gatto and ask him to vote against SB1221.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    will do!!
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    @ttddinh: thanks! I sent you a PM.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    @shishiinu-- I didn't get your pm
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    That's weird...
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    Anyhow, I called and left a msg
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Well after a short lived success to keep the bill from passing, SB1221 finally passed today. What a sad day for sound wildlife management, it's amazing how law makers can bypass the hard work put in by state biologists and basically give them the middle finger to say they know what's best for California's wildlife. I'm sure that hunting wild boar with dogs will shortly follow and every other hunting in the state.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • LosechLosech
    Posts: 2081
    This is really shitty.
    image
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 3663
    That really sucks.
    Lisa, Toby (Shiba), Oskar and Zora (American Akita), and Leo (Kai Ken)
  • WrylyBrindleWrylyBrindle
    Posts: 3219
    how did Gatto vote?
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    Unfortunately he voted in favor. I don't understand how they get to do re-votes.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • aykayk
    Posts: 1979
    I didn't follow this one as closely as the state-wide MSN, but they vote, find out who voted which way, pressure those who voted against it with threats of killing their own bills or withdrawing funding of their upcoming campaigns if they're of the same party, and then the Speaker or what-not brings it back to the table for a re-vote.
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    There's two more steps left for this bill to become law so next step is the senate appropriations comittee. Time for more phone calls...
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.
  • ttddinhttddinh
    Posts: 1990
    I have called but is the voicemail. Is there anything specific we should say?
  • shishiinushishiinu
    Posts: 2337
    I just leave a message urging the legislators to consider looking at te truth behind the work done by the dept. of Fish and Game. I'm at the point of begging them to look at the facts over personal feelings shown by the HSUS.
    Gen, Ami, Kaylynn, Trinity, Yusuke......Riki, Hana, Sammi, Taro, and the newest addition Koyuki.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

In this Discussion