"Come"

edited December 2011 in Behavior & Training
Hi, you all were so helpful with my spay question, I thought I'd pose another. Sachi will be 6 months old at the end of the week and I've had her since she was 8 weeks. We have taken training classes with a positive reinforcement behaviorist, or whatever they are called. Only treats and praise. I have actually, never shown her any anger or frustration, because she is good and I don't have many expectations of her. She will sit or lay down for a treat immediately, she is great at "leave it." She has a very soft mouth and is pretty good on a leash; any faults are mine. However, I am having difficulty getting her to come. If she is outside, and I call her, it is very unlikely that she will come unless I go get her or entice her with an extra special treat. Usually if I walk outside just a few feet she does come, I don't chase her. I have a little extra time over the holidays and want to do some extra training. Does anyone have any ideas to make "come" more fun. I truly think Sachi is like my cat. He comes when I call, if he feels like it, too. Thanks in advance for your ideas!

Comments

  • She is a beautiful girl! (Who apparently has many things to do other than coming when called!)

    It's a struggle, and I think it is one of the harder things to teach,esp with NKs, who often aren't really that interested in coming when called. My AA is pretty reliable--meaning he always will come when called, though if he is laying down outside in the snow on the deck in his "watch dog" position, he certainly won't come right away. (I still consider him pretty good, since the Shibas are not likely to come when called at all!)

    I ended up training him with two different recall words, because my husband uses "come here" all the time and never bothers to really reward it, so I knew that "come" would quickly lose its value as a command. So that's what we say when we mean we'd like him to come, but if he doesn't, it's not a huge deal. He probably responds to that about 70 % of the time.

    But I worked pretty hard on recalls with a totally different command and really good rewards (in his case, I started with treats, but moved on to squeaky toys which he adores), and so if I say "to me" and put my hand out for the nose touch, he's really pretty good about running over to do it, so he can get his favorite, for special occasions only toy.

    You have to spend a lot of time working on it without distractions first, and make sure if you use a super special recall word, as some people do for emergencies, that they ALWAYS come when you use that word, and they get whatever the love best as a reward--the absolute best treats ever, or a special toy, or whatever.

    I'm lucky that Oskar has always had a desire to be with us, and as a puppy loved the "follow me" game that made recall fairly easy, but I do think you can really work on it with special treats, and just make sure to save the actual recall command for times you're certain you can get them to come, so they always do it and always get rewarded. That's why I like the having two different commands thing.

    And Oskar is not reliable off leash, of course, but I don't even try that! I think getting him to come as much as he does is pretty successful, at least compared to the Shibas! With them, it's a good day if they come in the house at all!
  • Sachi looks great!

    As for the recall, I always tend have the best luck by getting the dog's attention and then running AWAY from them just a couple steps or using the 'puppy voice' and crouching (as if for petting). The latter works wonders for my Malamute who has a very 'che, whatever' response to the 'come' command when he's found something interesting.
  • I think you basically have to be patient and consistent, and then see what the dog wants to do for you over time. Tomoe has always been very good at recall when she is on a long lead or at training class or its otherwise part of a fun game. But when its 10pm and time for her to come in, used to be we'd have to go out with a leash, and follow her around for awhile until she let us get close enough to put the leash on her and bring her in.

    Now we no longer need to go out with the leash, she is much better at calming down and sitting when you go up to her, and then she will "go upstairs" happily. Even if she is too squirmy to let you come near her, you can still kind of get her to go upstairs. So we have basically made no progress on COME. But GO seems to work much better. :)

    The real problem is still when she gets out of the yard - when we catch up with her she knows her funtime is over, so she pretends she doesn't see us or hear us and keeps running around until she gets tired.
  • Thanks, for the advice! I try to use "Inside" as a "would you like to come in, it is optional" word. And was trying "come" as an absolutely, come here command. I really like the idea of the nose to hand idea, because that gives it another component which may add challenge. I think she has too many toys, none seem to be a favorite. She isn't very food driven, I have tried every healthy treat I could find. She finds them either not interesting or acceptable. The trainer recommended hot dogs. I found some free range turkey hot dogs without as much crap in them and they do work. The problem is if we practice 10-12 times in a row a couple of times a day, they give her the runs. I will also try the run away approach. That may work in the park. I can't run away from my back door though, or my indoor cats will get out. The funny thing is when we go to the 20 acre state park off leash area, she is really good. She stays with me, or at least within sight/sound; and comes to me to check in regularly. I really want just this one more command to be rock solid and then I will feel like we both have what we need from training. I know AA's are independent, I didn't get a lab because I didn't want a lab. I will just keep at it. It's me not her; right?
  • It's hard if they aren't super motivated by something, whether it is food or a toy. Even my Shibas will usually come for food. I think I was just lucky that Oskar is so toy motivated--anything squeaky gets his attention right now!

    When I read about the super special command for a reliable come, they suggested using only a very special high value treat, something pretty smelly too, like sardines or something. Messy, but if a dog likes it, it's a pretty high value reward. So you may have to find special really desirable treats for this command only.

    Oskar also is pretty decent if we're hiking--he doesn't like to get far away and checks in very reliably too.
  • Ooooo Sardines; good idea! She loves tuna too. I wonder if tuna cat treats would mess her up, they would be easier than actual tuna or sardines. Smelly, high value treats coming up! It is my goal for the next two weeks to practice, practice, practice.
  • Or, now that you've got me thinking, I'm going to try Niboshi (the Japanese snack) that would be less mess too.
  • Niboshi work great. I use that and anchovies but the type usually used for dashi so no salt added. Violet tends to get no more than 3-5 in a day, closer to 3 soif you need to use more for recall training, I imagine that your AA can handle that many (Violet is a skinny shiba girl).

    If Sachi loves briny ocean things you may also want to try nori. Both my guys also love that. Again I just check that there isn't salt added to the ones I purchase.
  • Thanks, good idea. I will be sure to look for some without salt or spices. Sachi weighs 55lbs now; so maybe if I break them up we can use 3-5 a day and that would still keep it special too. I have nori, so we'll try that also. If she like nori, that would be so easy and not much actual food per treat. I can't wait to get home from work to try some new things!
  • My dogs love the dried fish you can get either as cat treats, or simply little tiny dried anchovies that I get from the Asian grocery store, so those might work!
  • Didn't make it to the store for Niboshi, but she loved the Nori (I already had it). What a light easy treat! Now, to get that recall!!
  • edited January 2012
    I just wanted to update those of you who gave me ideas. Sachi is now 7 months old and heads the call of "come," almost all of the time! We went to a fenced in tennis court (2 courts). We practiced "come" over 20 times. I squat down to her level, call her name and then only say "come" once, I clap rapidly down low until she gets to me. The clapping seems to keep her attention when she is far away and other noises of sights/smells might be a distraction. I gave her small pieces of turkey hot dog. We then practiced only 2-3 times each day, with other treats or just praise. On Saturday, she hopped out of the car, not on a leash and headed across a parking lot. I didn't panic, I just called and she came right back. I am so happy.
  • Considering we have Yuki at us for only two months, he reacts really well to the "come" command. He was released of the lead only a few days ago for the fist time. We only have problems with birds and cats, he tends to chase them. Sometimes he runs up to other dogs to greet them. But i hope we will sort those things out with some additional training. :)
  • Congratulations on the training working out @sachismom :) I'm going to give that a try with Tsune when I take him to the tennis courts down the street that we also play at. We're in the middle of crate training right now and I caught him sleeping in it after I took a shower hurray haha. Going to finish that up this weekend and then work on "Come" next week.
  • @ cezieg Good luck with it. I think at 10 months Sachi has become a teenager, a lot of what she learned is being ignored now. I'll keep at it.
  • I've been practicing since Genji was a baby and I have an invisible fence that I couldn't use until he was older. I have a really long leash that I leave on him and he can roam freely but when I want him to come I don't say the word come unless if I have a pretty good idea that he is looking at me and will come otherwise he's going to learn that "come" means only if he wants to. I set him up to succeed. At first he was close enough to me with a leash that i could give a little tug and he'd come right over and get that good reward. Now he's on a shorter leash that he drags around. I'm not taking it off until I know he will come guaranteed. He's pretty good but he's a kai and he'd rather stay outside. I'm headed up north next week and what I really worry about it him bolting out the van or out the unfamiliar house I'm going to and he won't have a fence there. It's leash only. And good identification on his collar.
  • Thanks Carlkai, I just got back from a trip. I got Sachi a Tagg GPS tracker before we left. My aunt has 20 fenced acres and I wanted to be find her if she ran off. It was really helpful. But, she was terrible with "come" out there in a new place with so much to explore. She was better at 8-9 months. She will be a year old this month and I think we need a lot more practice this summer.
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