Breed Suggestions
Hopefully some members can clear up the Dog Breed Miasma I've been suffering from lately. Wasn't sure where to stick this topic since I'm looking for ALL breed suggestions.
I'm looking into a new dog. Moko is 12 and starting to show some old dog signs
She came as a rescue and is not a good Shiba candidate in confirmation. Probably in prey drive and stubbornness... I know exactly where I'm going in a few years but am having some issues deciding on a good companion.
In about a year I'll be moving into an 11.5' camper (currently being gutted and soon to be customised *squee*) and travelling across Canada. Staying as long as I like, working wherever, etc. I will be off grid so doing a lot of boondocking (staying in the wilderness) with occasional trips for water/food and other supplies. I don't intend to ever live in a non-movable house again. However, I may one day find a good place to stop travelling and hunker down on some property. In the camper.
I am a cat person and will always have a minimum of two. I currently have a rescued Conure (nooooot my species of choice) and intend to get a Rock Pebbler in the near future. Toying with getting some Lineolated Parakeets when the Conure is gone as Necho's enough of a PITA for me right now.
The non-pets are for me and the animals as food. They are: guinea pigs, multimammate mice, and coturnix quail. The only one not actually in the camper are the quail. Once I have property I'll be adding goats and bees. Eh, NOT in the camper.
For a dog I need:
- Independence
- Gets along with other animals
- Low grooming needs
- Don't want drooling
- Watchdog
It's not really set in stone. I love my Shiba's independence and her decision to fix her own problems. Sure, it can get kind of annoying but she's just like my cats that way. I do need a dog I can groom on my own as finding a good groomer across Canada may be tough. Staying in the middle of nowhere I would like a dog that lets me know what's going on, preferably one that has enough gumption to keep the intruder at bay while I grab my gun. I'm okay with prey drive and can work around it but there has to be a willingness to be trained out of barrier frustration and cat chasing, etc. I have no problems learning how to hunt with a dog (instead of walking the dog, seeing an animal, shooting said animal).
As for me; I'm not a couch potato but I have Up Time and Down Time. I can hike, go for a walk, do some hunting and then sit back and do chores, internet, and reading. I'm not a big trick trainer and usually train stuff that makes sense to me (cats to come when called, sit for dog, cats learn their name, cats learn to sit and watch me cook instead of stealing things, dog begs by politely sitting, dog is interrupted from obsessive sniffing by "come on" etc). I'm not particularly social and am very picky with who I make friends with.
As others on another forum have pointed out: LGD's fit that. Can I find anything on the breeds of LGD's that doesn't have the same list of traits as them all? Nope. However, the other forum was mostly people with traditional dogs and they didn't really understand the "independence" part. So any breeds you can suggest I would welcome! Plus some suggestions on an LGD that sounds right.
I'm looking into a new dog. Moko is 12 and starting to show some old dog signs
She came as a rescue and is not a good Shiba candidate in confirmation. Probably in prey drive and stubbornness... I know exactly where I'm going in a few years but am having some issues deciding on a good companion.In about a year I'll be moving into an 11.5' camper (currently being gutted and soon to be customised *squee*) and travelling across Canada. Staying as long as I like, working wherever, etc. I will be off grid so doing a lot of boondocking (staying in the wilderness) with occasional trips for water/food and other supplies. I don't intend to ever live in a non-movable house again. However, I may one day find a good place to stop travelling and hunker down on some property. In the camper.
I am a cat person and will always have a minimum of two. I currently have a rescued Conure (nooooot my species of choice) and intend to get a Rock Pebbler in the near future. Toying with getting some Lineolated Parakeets when the Conure is gone as Necho's enough of a PITA for me right now.
The non-pets are for me and the animals as food. They are: guinea pigs, multimammate mice, and coturnix quail. The only one not actually in the camper are the quail. Once I have property I'll be adding goats and bees. Eh, NOT in the camper.
For a dog I need:
- Independence
- Gets along with other animals
- Low grooming needs
- Don't want drooling
- Watchdog
It's not really set in stone. I love my Shiba's independence and her decision to fix her own problems. Sure, it can get kind of annoying but she's just like my cats that way. I do need a dog I can groom on my own as finding a good groomer across Canada may be tough. Staying in the middle of nowhere I would like a dog that lets me know what's going on, preferably one that has enough gumption to keep the intruder at bay while I grab my gun. I'm okay with prey drive and can work around it but there has to be a willingness to be trained out of barrier frustration and cat chasing, etc. I have no problems learning how to hunt with a dog (instead of walking the dog, seeing an animal, shooting said animal).
As for me; I'm not a couch potato but I have Up Time and Down Time. I can hike, go for a walk, do some hunting and then sit back and do chores, internet, and reading. I'm not a big trick trainer and usually train stuff that makes sense to me (cats to come when called, sit for dog, cats learn their name, cats learn to sit and watch me cook instead of stealing things, dog begs by politely sitting, dog is interrupted from obsessive sniffing by "come on" etc). I'm not particularly social and am very picky with who I make friends with.
As others on another forum have pointed out: LGD's fit that. Can I find anything on the breeds of LGD's that doesn't have the same list of traits as them all? Nope. However, the other forum was mostly people with traditional dogs and they didn't really understand the "independence" part. So any breeds you can suggest I would welcome! Plus some suggestions on an LGD that sounds right.
Comments
I have a japanese style futon that is rolled up and put away when not in use. I have a japanese low table with foldable legs so when I'm not using the table I just fold and put it up. Because I don't need chairs I only have cushions and those are easily stored. I own a LOT less than other people as well; if it doesn't have a purpose it doesn't belong in the house. The only things I bend for that are my collection of well loved books and my stuffed animals.
Now, as for the camper... I have blueprints but they're not on the computer. Um, I'll try to explain to the best of my ability. An 11.5 foot camper is essentially a big square. Because of it's size a portion of it "overhangs" the truck bed. The part that is on the truck bed has two raised spots to accommodate the wheel wells in the box. Then there is the overhang (also known as the queen bed is normal campers). I intend to gut the camper then insert customised furniture so if I ever need to buy another one I have a relatively easy way of moving things around (plus I just like the idea).
So; a small composting toilet as seen here which easily fits beside the wheel well. Laundry is old style (wringer and wash basin) with hanging to dry. Heat is a marine stove like this and a removable stack with a cover for driving. Washing is with a bucket and cup as seen here but standing in the laundry tub instead. The kitchen was the hardest but by cooking with coals and cast iron I do not need a stove nor an oven. In order to do this inside I will be building a "self contained kitchen" with the top being a heat resistant rock of some sort (haven't decided what yet). Because I've eliminated my useless crockery it won't need to be especially large. I will most likely be placing this over one of the wheel wells. The hardest decision was storage. I needed to store clothes, pantry stuff, animals things, and all those stupid knicknacks that we need but take up space. A step tansu was the decision for those. Considering I shall be using a very small ice box (and 12v freezer that will only be used for freezing said ice) I require ample space for dried and canned foodstuffs. Clothes don't need to be hung so what little I do have will be folded and stacked on the shelves within. The step tansu also provides (when covered in carpet) a cat tree. This will take up the other wheel well. A futon tansu for the futon, blankets and other sleeping paraphernalia will fit between the wheel well and the "wall" before the overhang. Upon here is the bird cages. I already have this one (which will house the Linnies once Necho is gone) and add one on top (or the slightly larger one that King's sells) for the Rock Pebbler.
Books will be inside a bookshelf between the door (which is on the side, weird for an overhang camper) and the wheel well. The table will have fasteners on the "wall" before the overhang so it can be placed up against the wall and secured into place when not using it. I haven't decided where the multimammate mice will be housed (a community style or 1:3 bins) but they will be placed on the opposite side of the futon tansu (between the other wheel well and the overhang "wall") The guinea pigs will be living on the overhang with a lip and roof so they don't fall off and are not bothered by the cats. The area left will be for the cat stuff (litter, water and lounging). Quail will be on the back of the camper (which is essentially a giant wall) housed either community style or 1:3 cages (haven't decided on the best way). The cages will include an area completely sealed and waterproof for driving (a quail coop if you will).
I have some wacky ideas for other things (an outdoor cat tree with walkways from an open window to a perching area) but we'll see how the set up goes. I've implemented a lot of it already (bucket washing, I'm currently building an ice box etc) and cut down on everything that uses electricity except the computer (solar power FTW in the camper). The cats will have the same outside time they have now (supervised but daily) and the bird cages aren't ideal but with a lot of out of cage time they're perfect space savers (plus one of the few cages that didn't assume my bird could fly like a helicopter). If I had gotten Necho earlier in life I could have taught him freeflight... I'm hoping the Rock Pebbler takes to it better especially when young and impressionable.
Hmmm... This was really long. Did it answer your q's at least?
It may be worth checking the laws in your area in regards to using dogs for hunting, you may benefit greatly from a hunting breed (laika, pointer, etc) as not only do they make it easier to hunt but you will also have a good companion to keep you company out in the bush. Though I'm not sure how well some of these hunting breeds would be with living with small animals, so it may be best to discuss that with enthusiasts of that breed.
A little OT, but why guinea pigs and not rabbits? Rabbits would be an easier animal to maintain since they don't have the dietary restrictions (i.e. vitamin C supplements) that guinea pigs have, so you could essentially feed them for free after knowing what plants are safe to eat or not. Plus their pelts are more useful and fetch a higher price, especially those with unique coat texture (rex, silver fox).
What's an LGD?
Have a look at the hungarian Kuvasz, I think they may suit you.. they're large though.
- Independence
- Gets along with other animals
- Low grooming needs
- Don't want drooling
- Watchdog
...akita? Assuming you'll get it as a puppy the "gets along with other animals" part will probably go well.
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I did have a pet rabbit but I am waaaaaay too allergic to them. To the point that I would worry about lung infections. Same with rats (which I did get a lung infection from) but rats were not an option because I have to go through Alberta. I'd love to breed rabbits because Guinea Pig hide is kind of pathetic
@shibamistress The JA is what I was thinking instead of an LGD. Hahaha, I think pretty much any dog will take up a ridiculous amount of floor space >.< A hyper dog would be the worst in such a space hence one that knows how to reeeelax.
@paranoidparrot Kuvasz are so pretty! The white LGD's are the prettiest in my eyes. Probably not for long if they're outside... I really, really don't want a puppy but I've become resigned to the fact I may have to get one so I can start from scratch, so to speak. I like puppies, but I also like leaving them behind.
One hunting breed that may be work looking into is a West Siberian Laika, very impressive hunting breed that (if my family were active hunters) I wouldn't mind getting someday. Not sure how one would do with your small animals, maybe @BradA1878 can help give some insight or you can check out the Laika forum
Sucks that you are allergic to rabbits, if you are serious about looking into rabbit maybe check out the Rex breed since their coat is short and plush they may not affect you as much as a standard coated breed. If you're on Facebook, join the group Backyard Meat Rabbits. Great group with a lot of info and maybe someone can offer up a means for you to work with rabbit without them making you sick. Warning, there are some gory images and discussions posted in that group, so if you're squeamish proceed with caution.
@calia I hope to hear from more people for sure! I believe I took a look at Laika before... I'll go do some digging on the forum. Most of my hunting is small animal and the occasional deer. Because I don't have a big freezer I try to avoid the large ones unless I'm prepared to eat a lot of jerky. There is the possibility of a "share" hunt with other people taking a portion of the meat or selling it so I'm not totally averse to moose/elk/bear etc.
Thanks for the suggestions so far! More stuff to research!
I do know they've been a popular family dog in America for a long time, and Americans typically don't like a dog that runs off and kills the small pets of children.
I thought of terriers in your case too. They can learn to get along with cats and birds, but I think rodents would be iffy, since so many were ratters. And, they don't tend to settle down that well....
I've noticed that dogs used in 'nihonken' Hunting (roam far from the hunter, hunt in male/female pairs, usually for large prey) tend to be labelled aloof. The Nihon ken, laika, kopov all have the same style. Quite interesting.
Hahaha, I also have two cats that never shut up, a bird that can scream your ears off and a dog that goes ballistic when she can't get to you. I am well prepared for noise. Well prepared.
I'm pretty sad that their isn't much information on the Slovensky Kopov in English. My dad works for a guy that hunts with two so maybe I can find out more. The one we had was a great dog; I really liked him.
I would actually throw a dutch shepherd out there for you, a female and more lower-drive from the litter / breeding. All three of ours are great with animals, settle down nicely after they get through the puppy stage, are great with strange dogs, and people, and are great alert dogs to weirdos and strange sounds lurking in the darkness, though are quiet the rest of the time. My female is only around 45lbs barely bigger than my Kishu girl, and my largest boy [ who is on the upper end for the breed ] is 75lbs.
If you can find a good breeder who will pick the right pup out for you, you'd be golden. That said, they are not really hunters. ~
I don't know how you are about velcro dogs, but I've found a lot of hounds to be way way too needy for me. I like the viszlas a lot for example, and I had a friend who had a pointer, and I've also met some wiemeraners, and all of them were way too needy. Those are, though, gundogs, so maybe it's just them? And some people don't mind it, but I hate it when dogs always want to be in physical contact with me or follow me around in the house and things like that. I had a catahoula/pit cross for awhile and he drove me nuts...always wanting to be close to me. But I don't know if that was the pittie or the hound, so who knows?
The Akitas are about as "needy" as I can take, and they aren't much. They might like to lean on me occasionally, and they may move over to the part of the room I'm sitting in, but they don't need to be in constant contact, nor are they always looking to be given something to do (as was the case with my German Shepherd). My Kai Ken likes to come over a couple of times a day to be petted, and he does like to lay near me. The Shiba? He just likes to be in the same room! I tend to like the dogs that don't demand a lot of attention.
I looked them up and the brindle short hair's are gorgeous
Ah, I don't really require a hunting dog I just know that if I ended up with one I'd love to train it to hunt what I hunt. Any dog I get will need to do the hiking/walking I do but could easily be given a pack or sled as a job. I'm not picky
@shibamistress My parents have a Corgi x JRT puppy and Oooooh. Myyyy. Gaaaawd I would be pulling my hair out within two days! High drive, high energy it's like my nightmare dog.
I'm honestly having trouble finding the velcro rating for the hounds. Most of the information is the generic "loyal and determined hunters" with no mention of preferred affection. I'm trying to think of the dogs I've met... my parents have a terrible track record with dogs BUT I've met Pom's, Pitties, Catahoula cross, German Shepherd cross, and a Slovakian Kopov off the top of my head. There were some family friends that had bird dogs, too. And our neighbors "breed" labs. Out of them all the only ones I could really stand was Buster, our Slovakian. Then again he was already a year old when we got him and... well, he didn't last long under my parents. Slipped his collar and took off
I prefer cats. Always have, always will. Moko is pretty much the perfect cat-dog. She decides when she wants attention then demands it. Content to laze about the room you are in. Requires creative training and prevention (she wore a large spiked collar for a while once she realized her eyes didn't hurt anymore and she could fit under the baby gate). Is pig-headed about things she wants. I could go on and on. I'm thinking out of the Nihon ken the JA might be my best choice.
My eldest boy Wraith at 4 [ the over-standard boy at 75lbs ] was the most aloof in his litter, much like an NK, but after he hit 3 years old he likes to be snuggled up next to us and will shove his head under our arms if we ignore him. He's a very silly pup, LOVES everyone and everything, even the birds who've escaped and made it into his crate while we were out. We came back home to find him going "Ma! Pa! Look at my new roommate!
Aggro is the next male, shares the same dad as Wraith, but he's about 55 - 60lbs [ been a while since he was weighed ]. He's a long-coat, but from 2 working-line short coats. He just turned 2 in May, so still a little young to tell. He's very even tempered, easy to settle, will do whatever you want him to do as long as he understands it, doesn't range far, loves other dogs, will accept love from other people but doesn't CRAVE them like Wraith does. He's good with other critters, mainly ignores them. He settles very nicely, and usually chooses to be about 10 feet away as his laying down / chill spot. He does NOT need to be right next to us, he's a little random. He has a ton of endurance and loves long hikes.
Siren is the youngest, a year and few months, and a female. She is by far the most obedient and most easy to train. She was wary of people nihon-ken style, but was easy to socialize / condition. She loves other dogs, & is ok with the other critters. She's a very sweet pup, once she sees you as "family" she always wants you in her sight. IE, on hikes, if the person or dog out of 10 is walking her in front, she will refuse to continue walking until the rest of the group, dog or human, catches up
All of them have good judgement, and will let out warning barks at strange sounds around the house, or weirdos on walks [ but not normal folks walking by ] They can all be "hyper" but no more then the nihon ken I think, a good hike, bike ride, long walk, etc. will get them to settle easily. None of them are "Velcro," IMHO, the way a Dobe is. Maybe compared to an NK, they love their people and want them in their sights, but they don't just run off to never never land without a thought in the world either. TBH, my shikoku was UBER velcro compared to my dutch. Not in a touchy way, but if we left the room for 2 seconds he would throw a shit fit kind of way haha.
IMHO, if you can find a breeder you can trust for them [ as I have, otherwise I wouldn't have gotten 3 from her!
For me, my number one concern was 1. I wanted a pup who would be very dog social and get along with the rest of my pack, especially the Nihon Ken & 2. that was not the highest drive, but not 0 drive either. I told this to my breeder and even though they have all different personalities, she picked the perfect pup for me, not once, not twice, but three times.
I love my Kishu gal....and I loved and still love my shikoku boy more then anything else in this world, but I will always always have a dutch shepherd in my life. Each has their challenges, [ Wraith gets too excited about things, Aggro had carsickness, & Siren it was her people-worries ] BUT....I always know I can work through their fears. And we have. ANd it's like they never had the issue to begin with. [ Ok, except maybe Wraith, he still thinks everyone but the weirdos are his Best Friend EVER. lol ] ~
I expect no matter what dog I get I will regret a lot during the puppy/adolescent years. I mean, I love my cats but two kittens (one semi-feral, the other with severe separation anxiety)... hopefully not going through THAT nightmare again anytime soon. I will seriously consider the breeder/rescue conundrum as well. I've been through a lot with Moko and don't know if I could chance it with another rescue dog...
Actually, funnily enough, Moko is like that as well. When she knows you are there but can't reach you she has a screaming contest with the bird. I wish I could meet some Dutchies and interact with them. I've met some Mal's and I didn't like their... neurotic tendencies. But I've only met German Shepherd crosses so don't have a good frame of reference for them.
This is what I like about this forum! So many breeds I never would have considered otherwise!
My dutch are very stable, if that makes sense. I know their "weaknesses" & I know their "strengths," but what I love, personally, is I can actually work with them through it. With my shikoku & kishu, it's an uphill battle, sadly. My kishu was fantastic off-leash, until she hit 3 or 4 months old, then she just said "Screw you!" and didn't care. Likewise, she's soooooo unpredictable around other dogs, and it's impossible to get her attention away from what SHE wants. My shikoku was uber dog friendly, and my best off-leash pup, but he was SO sensitive...he shut down easily towards the tiniest of stimuli, it made him difficult to work with.
I guess one of the reasons I love my dutchies so much, is they are not 100% velcro like a Dobe, they can think on their own, but also take direction pretty well. They're up for any adventure, but also settle down in the house too. And what issues they do have are very easy to work through, especially compared to my uber sensitive [ or uber uncaring ] NK.
That said, I'm talking about a few examples of each breed. Maybe most Kishu aren't like Dragoon [ though after extensive reading of experiences, they share more traits then not haha ] & I know Fate was a very unusual shikoku in his love for other dogs and his extreme off-leash reliability [ never more then 7ft away! ] and my dutch are all related.... but hey, dogs are like people, they don't all fit into one mold
In the end, I have no doubt you'll find the right breed, but most importantly the right pup! I won't lie, my pups have traits that, before I got them, I would have said I NEVER wanted, but now that I have them, and have raised them, lived with them, and loved them....their traits are their personalities and I love them more for it