Xrays, Asleep vs awake. Questions

lizzysilvertongue

I feel like this may have been a thread before but couldnt find it. Sorry if some of these are dumb questions.

I have been looking into getting arashi's hips and everything else xrayed for preliminary testing. So far i have only found vets that do it while under anesthesia, i prefer to avoid anesthesia whenever it isnt necessary. I however remember someone saying they had their dogs done while awake?

Is it more common to be done awake or asleep?

Are puppy xrays done awake? Im assuming so because i figure the anesthesia could be harmful?

Trzcina

When my Lapphund had her OFA done (this was a bit over a decade ago now), the vet used sedation but not complete anesthesia. He was considered unusually good (good enough that the breeder was willing to drive a few hours to get the dogs x-rayed even though there were closer options), and was one of the relatively few who would use sedation rather than anesthesia--from what I remember him saying, it's difficult to keep them still and in position long enough without something. But even though he's now long since retired, I would imagine there are other vets who do it with mild sedation.

He did three dogs from the same litter during the same appointment, but they weren't prelims--they were all just barely 2 years old. I don't know if he did prelim x-rays differently.

But I could be completely wrong. This is just what I remember being told at the time.

WrylyBrindle

Good hip xrays (in focus and positioned straight and centered)- are done while under anesthesia because the dog needs to lie still on their back while having their legs pulled straight out to reveal the hip socket at extension on the film. Almost no dogs will tolerate this from a vet in a weird room. Even with knocked-out dogs, some vets will take a misaligned picture, so if you want accurate xrays, I am afraid anesthesia is the way to go.

I dont know how old Arashi is, but unless you suspect a problem, and if you are doing xrays in prep for breeding, know that OFA certification is granted over age 2, you can do "prelims' before that and that results at 18 months stay the same as at 2 years 95% of the time.

PoetikDragon

You have to ask yourself, do you want the x-rays to look their best or be the most accurate for your breeding decisions? These are not the same thing.

Taking x-rays without any chemical restraint will make the dog very tense. If there is laxity in the joint it may be hidden by the dog straining against the examiner and forceful manipulation of its legs. If you can get correctly positioned pictures at all (not always possible with some dogs) the hips will look very tight - great if you're looking for a good score* or to hide a problem, not-so-great if you want an accurate understanding of how good the dog's hips are. (Also, there is a chance that the dog could struggle and accidentally get injured by the people holding him down. And it certainly is not a positive experience either way.)

* OFA requires that the type of restraint is written on the form and usually lowers scores that have no chemical restraint because they look tighter than they actually are. So if your dog actually has very good tight hips he may still not receive Excellent because there was no restraint use and OFA penalized his score.

Conversely, taking x-rays under full anaesthesia can add more laxity than is naturally present in the joint. The hips may look worse and again this isn't necessarily an accurate picture of how the dog's hips are put together.

The third option is light sedation as @Trzcina mentioned - not too much tension from being awake and struggling nor too much laxity from unnaturally deep sleep. It is not a perfect solution but I prefer it over the other two options. I think its the closest to showing how the dog's hips are put together naturally.

In a perfect world we could take pictures of the dog's hips as he is every day - awake and alert but not tense and stressed.

lizzysilvertongue

Thank you I will look into the sedation then, I much rather they be accurate. Arashi is a few months shy of 2 years but I suspect her 3rd heat will be at 1 year and 11 months so I was going to get them done in preparation for breeding.

Calia

Don't get them done too close to her heat, I hear that the change in hormones can also cause inaccurate results.

PoetikDragon

Yes. If she is within 30 days before or after her heat, there may be swelling that also makes the joint appear to have more laxity. The ideal time to take the x-rays is exactly opposite her season. So if her anestrus is 180 days long, take it on day 90.

I had this problem with one of my girls with really short seasons, I kept getting x-rays done and then she'd start her heat the next week. Finally got it sorted out though.

lizzysilvertongue

Her 2 cycles were 7 months apart. Her last one was in March so in the next couple weeks should be fine I think? I really appreciate the advice. thank you.

shibamistress

Yes, go with some form of sedation. We just did hip and spine xrays on my old Shiba (he's 10), obviously not for OFA but because I wanted to know if he had any arthritis in there. They gave him a "margarita" as my vet calls it (light sedation, probably acepromazine, but I didn't ask), and did the xrays and he cooperated well. And his hips look great! My vet said if she was doing an OFA testing, she would think it would come back as good. No arthritis in his spine either, thankfully. (But his knee is a mess, poor boy! Grade 4 LP).

Anyway, he was easy to handle with the light sedation, and the xrays looked good, so that's why they do it!